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News Smart Talk What are the pros and cons of selling off PA's liquor stores; LCB CEO joins discussion
Tuesday, 20 September 2011 14:01

What are the pros and cons of selling off PA's liquor stores; LCB CEO joins discussion

Written by  Scott LaMar, Director of Radio Smart Talk

Radio Smart Talk for Wednesday, September 21:

When the 18th Amendment that prohibited the manufacture, transportion, or sale of alcohol in the U.S. was repealed in 1933, Pennsylvania Governor Gifford Pinchot helped to develop a stucture for selling liquor and wine that he said would be, "inconvenient and expensive as possible."

Gov. Pinchot supported the continuation of prohibition and as a result came up with a system that kept the state firmly in control of retail sales of alcohol in Pennsylvania.

Three former Pennsylvania governors have proposed privatizing the sale of liquor and wine, but were unsuccessful because their proposals were opposed by unions representing liquor store workers, conservative lawmakers, groups like Mothers Against Drunk Driving that believed a change could result in more drinking and more drinking-related highway crashes, and religious organizations.

Consequently, Pennsylvania is one a few states that maintains complete control of the purchase of liquor and wine for retail sale at state-owned stores.  Last year, the sale of liquor and wine brought in more than $83 million in profit to the state.

However, Pennsylvania, like almost every other state in the country, faces a daunting fiscal challenge.  Gov. Tom Corbett said there just isn't enough money in the state budget to pay for everything the state has done in the past.  As a result, Corbett cut billions from the state's 2011-2012 fiscal year budget. 

A proposal to sell off the state's more than 600 Wine and Spirit Shoppes to realize a financial windfall is being taken seriously -- maybe for the first time ever.

On Wednesday's Radio Smart Talk, we'll hear two different points of view on liquor privatization from Joe Conti, CEO of the Pennsylvania Liquor Control Board and Matthew Brouillette, president and CEO of the Libertarian Commonwealth Foundation.

LISTEN TO PROGRAM:  

comments  

 
# Jim 2011-09-20 15:40
I'm a registered Democrat and fairly progressive on many issues. But, I feel strongly that PA needs to get rid of the State Store system. Selling booze is so not a core function of state government. We have an opportunity to get an much-needed infusion of cash to pay for things like rebuilding our infrastructure.

The present system results in less convenience, poorer selection and higher prices for customers. With the exception of the state store workers who understandably want to keep their jobs, there is hardly any constituency in favor of keeping the present system. Let's do this.
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# bob 2011-09-21 09:16
In my younger days I remember how easy it was to get beer from the private beer distributors. I would think that a private liquor store would be just a easy.
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# Robin 2011-09-21 09:16
House Bill 11 has been mentioned. Is the exact language of the bill available? If so, what does it say?

Thank you,
Robin
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# William 2011-09-21 09:25
Privatize it and tax it like cigarettes; great revenue source.
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# Tom Zug 2011-09-21 09:30
I have not heard the argument made yet whether the current system is close to the walmart model, as a large buyer and can get better prices.
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# bob 2011-09-21 09:34
I agree with the comment about $8 hr clerks that will not care, and might be willing to sell a bottle for an extra $20.
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# bob 2011-09-21 09:45
The Kiosk were manufactured by a private company...why is it PLCBs fault that these machines did not operate properly, or that people couldn't follow simple instructions.
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# Mike 2011-09-21 11:35
Quoting bob:
The Kiosk were manufactured by a private company...why is it PLCBs fault that these machines did not operate properly, or that people couldn't follow simple instructions.

Because the plcb was told by its own analysts that it was a bad idea and that customers wouldn't like it, and the plcb leadership ignored their own advice!
Go figure, most people don't like being treated like criminals and required to submit to a breathalizer and face recognition scan before they buy a bottle of wine that they can pull right off a shelf in most states.
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# Jim Gawn 2011-09-21 09:49
It's a matter of balancing individual liberty (to buy and sell what we wish) against protecting the public good. In this case, it is hard to see how the continued imposition of a state monopoly serves the public good.
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# bob 2011-09-21 09:50
Matt always seems to twist facts on every issue that he comments on. His views at this point or any point have become irrelevant.

If he'd start giving full facts, maybe people would take him seriously, until then, he's just another clown.
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# Dawn 2011-09-21 09:56
Joe Conti said that he (and the PLCB) are simply acting on behalf of the people in the neighborhoods. According to Quinnipiac, 69% of Pennsylvanians support privatizing liquor sales. How does he reconcile this?

http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1327.xml?ReleaseID=1610
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# Joel 2011-09-21 09:57
As a Parent
I lived in NYC as a teenager and it is much easier for underage to buy where the outlets are owned by mom and pops that are under pressure to support their families and look the other way.

As a Taxpayer
We have to resist the attraction of Ideology and get back to what works--the State coffers will suffer. I don't believe 1,200 outlets will ever be sold at anything other than bargain prices. Auditor General is opposed for these and other fiscal reasons.

Beer
I firmly believe that PA's citizens conflate beer and other alcohol. There's no pressure in NY State to open liquor stores on Sunday, but beer can be purchased in food stores. The Tavern Assoc. will not allow it and ensures a restricted beer system through campaign contributions.
IF BEER CAN BE SOLD IN FOOD STORES THIS DISCUSSION WOULD END AND THE CURRENT SYSTEM WILL REMAIN.
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# Sarah 2011-09-21 09:58
If it isn't 'broke' , don't 'fix' it! Tne 'liquor' control in PA works fine as it is!
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# Jim Gawn 2011-09-21 10:02
Regarding the comment about "computer programs that fail": government has no monopoly on failed automation projects. Failures and delays happen often in private business too.
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# Mike 2011-09-21 11:30
Quoting Jim Gawn:
Regarding the comment about "computer programs that fail": government has no monopoly on failed automation projects. Failures and delays happen often in private business too.

yes but when their own analysts warn them that a project or a product is a bad idea, they don't usually proceed with it, and if they do they're held accountable for their massive failure by being demoted or fired.
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# Michael 2011-09-21 10:03
One of the main reasons ( if not the main reason ) for eliminating
the PLCB is Political patronage! Mr Conti is a premier "football hider" he side stepped the issue of how he got his job, pure Political patronage. His Job was created for him. His defense of the "kiosk" fiasco was laughable. What are Mr Conti's qualifications to run a billion dollar business? Mr Conti is a political hack. The sooner we get rid likes of him and the PLCB the better. His false concern for low level State store employes is so transparent. Mr Conti's, and other high level PLCB management, are only concerned about their own fat pay checks payed by the taxpayer. The PLCB is a Political run organization for the benefit of politicians.
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# Mike 2011-09-21 11:27
Totally true. The last chairman, and the last one who was remotely competent, Newman, said the new position wasn't necessary. But Conti needed another government job after his consituents booted him, and based on the plcb's record since he became "CEO", you can see why he couldn't hack it in the private sector.
Exhibit A is the kiosk failure, which both he and Stapleton are still defending! If this police enforced monopoly were actually "run like a business", there would be accountability and Conti and Stapleton would be fired.
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# Bruce 2011-09-21 10:04
Stop with the myths, already, Mr. Commonwealth Foundation. The prices in PA are competitive, the selections are as good as you'll find anywhere, and the stores create more than $500 million a year for PA's taxpayers. Where are you going to go to replace that money, Mr. Brouilette? You won't even tell us who supports you financially. You're just shilling for the out-of-state Big Alcohol and the Big Box Stores, who will profit from privatization. And as for WITF starting off with it's "1933" history, how about waking up, folks. It's 2011 -- nearly 80 years later. This system isn't broke. It' doesn't need fixing.
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# Mike 2011-09-21 11:22
Quoting Bruce:
Stop with the myths, already, Mr. Commonwealth Foundation. The prices in PA are competitive, the selections are as good as you'll find anywhere, and the stores create more than $500 million a year for PA's taxpayers. Where are you going to go to replace that money, Mr. Brouilette? You won't even tell us who supports you financially. You're just shilling for the out-of-state Big Alcohol and the Big Box Stores, who will profit from privatization. And as for WITF starting off with it's "1933" history, how about waking up, folks. It's 2011 -- nearly 80 years later. This system isn't broke. It' doesn't need fixing.


If you think the selection in PA is as good as anywhere, then you're hopelessly ignorant and I have to assume you've never been outside the state. Try going to Delaware, as many PA residents already do. They aren't wasting gas for a "myth".
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# Mike 2011-09-21 13:06
oh, and you'll replace that $500 million, which is mostly taxes, with the taxes that will be collected from the private businesses, and then some, especially considering all the purchases that are lost to neighboring states.
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# Brooke 2011-09-22 01:23
Wow. It was amazing to hear Matthew Brouillette argue that both lower wages and higher wages for liquor store clerks would be beneficial for PA residents. How is that possible? HOW?
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# Bruce 2011-09-22 16:33
Mike -- don't angst over the kiosks. The best businesses try many new ideas, and not all of them succeed. And as for prices and selection, I have been to other states, but you obviousdly haven't been to a PA store recently. The "bad selection and high prices" stuff and the "sales lost to other states" line are from the right-wing playbook and are not supported by the facts. If the state goes private and you find a crummy liquor story on your corner selling booze to kids, your neighbors won't deserve it -- but you will.
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# Bruce 2011-09-22 16:35
Typo fixed:

Mike -- don't angst over the kiosks. The best businesses try many new ideas, and not all of them succeed. And as for prices and selection, I have been to other states, but you obviousdly haven't been to a PA store recently. The "bad selection and high prices" stuff and the "sales lost to other states" line are from the right-wing playbook and are not supported by the facts. If the state goes private and you find a crummy liquor store on your corner selling booze to kids, your neighbors won't deserve it -- but you will.
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# Michael 2011-09-23 16:52
Hey Bruce check the PLCB Users Group site, they analyzed the selection and show that PA is worse in almost every category compared to private states. I'll take their word for it over your totally baseless assertions.
As for your equally baseless assertion that stores will be opening on every corner and selling to children, read the current bill, it allows for 1200 licences, hardly enough for the downfall of society. Besides, considering PA's rates of DUI, underage and binge drinking, your beloved government monopoly isn't saving the children any better than private states.
Oh, and I was just in a state store two days ago, the selection of wine sucks, and its the same at every regular state store, because the unknown bureaucrats in Harrisburg decide what we should be allowed to buy.
But hey if you like the government choosing what you can and can't drink, you can move to Utah. The majority in PA are ready to be treated like adults.
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# Bruce 2011-09-23 17:05
Mike -- PLCB users group? That's certainly one unbiasd source -- not. Recent news stories in the real media ( who certainly are no fans of the PLCB) told of a survey by the Neilsen organization that showed prices compared favorably to out of state stores. Sure, some of the PLB stores are smaller, but you'd find the same thing in a private system. Tell me that you can't find the wine you're looking for in the Ardmore store or 1218 Chestnut St. in center city or at many other larger stores, and I'll tell you to go back and tell the clerks what you're looking for and they will order it for you. Try that in a private store.
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# Bill Saganich 2011-09-25 11:59
I moved to this state 3 years ago from Connecticut. I am dismayed at the way beer, wine and spirits are sold.
To me it makes so much sense to sell all these items in one store run by private a company. The pricing is competive and the stores are convenient. If they are not profitable they close.
I do not think there are more drinkers in Connecticut vs Pennsylvania.
The state government need to get out of the retail business.
I listened to your program and found the government person mostly trying to justify his job. Non of what he said made any sense.
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